By Zach W. (Zach) (216.239.165.232) on Monday, November 11, 2002 - 05:42 am:

Will we be seeing it soon?
The Folks over at Luxology must be cooking up something real good for us, "soon to be impatient users".

Better animation tools, and ogl speed optimizations? Maybe a port to Linux(is it that hard to port to, when they have the darwin(osx)version already done?

What about a scene file exchange between Maya and Lightwave. Wouldn't that be nice!

I've been playing with Maya lately, and "wow" pretty nice of them to put the unlimited modeling tools into complete, and mental ray will be implemented in all future versions? That renderer rivals Lightwaves for sure. hmmm

Please give us something more to chew on, like letting us get to an objects vertex in layout by pressing a button and being able to animate them... and an ik tool where you select the root bone and then the end bone, and you have a chain (just like maya!)...

Blasphemer! I mentioned maya too much in this message. I will shut up now.

By Larry Shultz "SplineGod" (Larrys) (216.244.21.189) on Monday, November 11, 2002 - 02:04 pm:

I seem to remember Chuck saying that Newtek is the sole developer of Lightwave or did I miss something?

By arthur argote (Archiea) (66.32.146.12) on Monday, November 11, 2002 - 02:38 pm:

Larry, it hinkits just moe confusion... the title of the post alone should be evidence of this....

By Beam Tracer (Beamtracer) (210.50.30.21) on Monday, November 11, 2002 - 02:54 pm:

I think the post at the top of this thread was meant to promote Maya, rather than achieve anything else. It's deliberately intended to stir up the Lightwave users, and then add the suggestion of using Maya.

Zach: If you don't work for Alias/Wavefront, you sure look like you do!

By Matt Clary (Mattclary) (208.255.196.106) on Monday, November 11, 2002 - 03:12 pm:

Or maybe he's just trolling for a response.

By Michael Green (Dodgy) (195.92.67.74) on Monday, November 11, 2002 - 04:22 pm:

For an autoIK setup try AutoIk:

AutoIKlscript autoik.ls (3 k)

By Michael Green (Dodgy) (195.92.67.74) on Monday, November 11, 2002 - 04:24 pm:

Or fastIK, directions at Flay.com as always

By Zach W. (Zach) (216.239.178.105) on Tuesday, November 12, 2002 - 04:05 am:

Larry, I understood it to be that Luxology develops Lightwave, and NewTek distributes it. But maybe it's the other way around, or maybe i'm just the other way around.

and Argote, what the heck is "hinkits", I'm pretty sure what "moe" is, but "hinkits"?

Yah Mr. Tracer, now all's i need is a big check from A|W, and life would be golden!

Clary's right though, I am curious when the next upgrade is coming out, and I am real curious what it's going to have in it!

do you think they're going to change the grading system to something like Macromedia did, bringing out MX. Wasn't it pi at luxology before 7.5 was released?

Thanx Michael, I'm downloading that script right now, and i'm going to check it out tonight. Thankyou, Thankyou. I heard about one of those two you mentioned and I totally spaced it.

By arthur argote (Archiea) (66.32.146.12) on Tuesday, November 12, 2002 - 06:15 am:

Zach..

thats my nasty crack habbit kicking in....

I think the latest upgrade to 8 is a pipe dream and you should all go back to work!!

By Beam Tracer (Beamtracer) (210.50.30.22) on Tuesday, November 12, 2002 - 08:52 am:

Whatever Luxology's mysterious "relationship" with Newtek, their backtracking pretty well ensures that when Lightwave8 is released you won't hear the news from them.

By Chuck Baker (Cbaker) (207.235.86.2) on Tuesday, November 12, 2002 - 09:58 am:

You remember correctly, Larry! NewTek is the sole developer and marketer of LightWave 3D and any derivative products.

By Larry Shultz "SplineGod" (Larrys) (209.179.141.189) on Tuesday, November 12, 2002 - 05:17 pm:

Thanks Chuck...I was doubting my sanity for a second there... ;)
Zach,
I dont think anyone but Luxology has said that..

By Beam Tracer (Beamtracer) (210.50.30.22) on Tuesday, November 12, 2002 - 06:18 pm:

Luxology never existed. It was all a bad dream! Go back to sleep!

By Tom Winnicki (Tom_Winnicki) (65.93.70.142) on Tuesday, November 12, 2002 - 07:12 pm:

I promissed him I wouldn't tell, but maybe he won't get mad if I'll be this indirect. Here it goes, I'm spilling the beans. Form very reliable sources... ummmm maybe I shouldn't.... But I'm just so damn excited about this! Hell fire and damnation shall be my reward but I just can't keep a secret. I have some great news for LW 8 and kick-ass news for LScript. If you knew how deep I'm into LScripting you'd know why I'm so extatic. This I'll say and I'll say no more. Now I'll open up the floor for wild speculations.

By Emmanuel Henne (Emmanuel) (145.254.209.128) on Wednesday, November 13, 2002 - 07:43 am:

I am glad I got my pencils and acrylics.
No new improvements, no bugs, they just work out of the box, even on old PCs ;)

By Chris S. (Fez) (68.51.136.137) on Wednesday, November 13, 2002 - 08:21 am:

The meteor may be hurtling toward earth as I type, Tom...tell us before it is too late!

By Michael Green (Dodgy) (217.207.247.34) on Wednesday, November 13, 2002 - 09:59 am:

Tell all Tom... Or we shall bring out the comfy chair!!! And I really mean it!!!

By Userdelta (Userdelta) (64.174.20.238) on Wednesday, November 13, 2002 - 10:10 am:

this is how they do it in psychology

tom, no, dont tell us. we dont really want nor need to know, and plus, its a very big a secret.

hehe.

By Emmanuel Henne (Emmanuel) (145.254.223.182) on Wednesday, November 13, 2002 - 10:16 am:

Come one Tom, keep that secret, I mean, it is good to keep a secret...nobody else knows but You.Oh boy, if everbody knew what YOU know, they would giggle all day long, right ?

I take the blue pill and go on with my life, wonderland is not for me.

By Richard Stallsmith (Lwaddict) (63.125.144.5) on Wednesday, November 13, 2002 - 11:03 am:

Funny thing is...
if you read Tom's message slowly...LOL
It looks like he thinks he already said something.

Emmanuel,
I think Tom already took the blue pill. LOL

By Matt Clary (Mattclary) (208.255.196.107) on Wednesday, November 13, 2002 - 11:27 am:

You're not going to hear anything substantial about LW 8 from Tom or anyone else. That would be the quickest way to get on Newtek's bad side, and that just wouldn't be worth it in the long run.

By Christian Avalos (Cavalos) (64.213.56.192) on Wednesday, November 13, 2002 - 11:53 am:

I think this is a good time to hire some brilliant pelope out there NT!

Best
Christian

By stephen gilbert (Cresshead) (213.104.180.12) on Wednesday, November 13, 2002 - 05:24 pm:

hi
i emailed "tom"...

here's his reply>>

Just like me you'll have to sit tight and see what really happens.

so why did you bother to say anything then!!

as usual someone got a big spoon as a present..needed to try some stirring!

steve g

By Tom Winnicki (Tom_Winnicki) (65.93.67.242) on Wednesday, November 13, 2002 - 06:08 pm:

I'm just a troublemaker

By Cholo (Cholo) (200.67.231.11) on Wednesday, November 13, 2002 - 07:25 pm:

Like Woody Woodpecker

By Zach W. (Zach) (66.178.131.251) on Wednesday, November 13, 2002 - 09:22 pm:

he he

By stephen gilbert (Cresshead) (62.254.0.4) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 06:22 am:

i reckon we're all very eager to see the next version!

steve g

By Matt Clary (Mattclary) (208.255.196.113) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 06:49 am:

Tell me about it! I'm still on 6.5 due to a self imposed "every other version" upgrade cycle. The suspense is killing me, I'm ready for the new features that were introduced in 7.x, let alone 8.

By Emmanuel Henne (Emmanuel) (145.254.225.86) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 09:44 am:

There is already a 6.5 ???
Damn, they just announced 5.0 I thought, with something they call like Metanurse or Meganudes or something...

By Wizlon (Wizlon) (194.176.153.162) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 09:47 am:

Hold on a minute, this is getting silly now, I was talking to a guy from a company that beta tests and helps develop the new versions of Lightwave, he told me that the people from Lux are developing 8, and that - i quote "just wait until you see the charater animation tools, they have gone through the roof!"
Let's get some clarity here.
We want straight answers from both sides!

By Robert Hevor (Robert_H) (66.157.248.226) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 09:59 am:

Oh boy, you just stirred up a beehive now
I HOPE your Not just playing around, cause what you said would be really cool. (the Character anim tools gone through the roof part )

By Steve White (Hrgiger) (65.24.112.98) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 11:50 am:

As long as we're throwing around an unsubstantiated rumors, I've got one for you. Project messiah has dropped their prices on their products. Maybe it's because LW8 will have enough character animation tools to make it obsolete? Maybe they know something we don't? And oh yeah, NASA did fake the Apollo moon landings while we're at it.

By Richard Stallsmith (Lwaddict) (63.125.144.5) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 11:59 am:

I understand that Chupa Cabras are being used in the testing of the new Mocap abilities of 8

By arthur argote (Archiea) (66.32.133.156) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 12:28 pm:

I'm assuming that this is all for entertainment purposes only. That nobody really expected a serious response. I don't get what the urgency with 8 is considering what available NOW. Things like Messiah, G2, Impact, relativity. there's alot to work with now.

regarding Messiah's price now, who's really surprised. You wanna surprise me, tell me that they released a mac version finally after promising it for 4 years...

if and when 8 comes, it comes. I've got way too much stuf going on to distract myself with learning tools....

By Tim Parsons (Timparsons) (207.140.222.50) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 02:30 pm:

This is straight from Luxology's website about the company founders! Notice the past tense of the wording. Terms such as "remained","was" and "worked" and the 2001 date make it fairly clear that they are no longer involved with the development of Lightwave. In these economic times and with the sales stagnation of 3D software it makes one wonder what they could be up to. I find it hard to believe that there would be room for another 3D application no matter what the cost and feature set. Lets face it, the industry is surviving on yearly upgrades, and a new player would be hard pressed to find any kind of market penetration.
Makes you wonder who is working on version 8, if anybody!

"Allen Hastings' far-reaching vision is always tempered by mathematical accuracy and flawless execution. With a background in fine art and music, Allen first started writing software to make 3D digital movies at a time when few believed it was possible. His efforts were some of the first off-the-shelf 3D packages available. He created NewTek's LightWave 3D in 1989 and remained the primary force behind its animation and rendering algorithms through 2001."


"Stuart Ferguson started programming in elementary school and has never stopped. Even before completing his computer science degree, Stuart worked professionally on visualization and interactive systems for users as diverse as astrophysicists and businessmen. His commitment to user interface design led him to create LightWave's Modeler 3D, now recognized as a premier geometric modeling system. Stuart worked on the LightWave product from 1990 through 2001, and in addition to modeling was responsible for much of the general application infrastructure."

By Adam Jeffries (Zithen) (24.205.95.5) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 02:47 pm:

Well...then I guess that means they're no longer working on Lightwave, or the Lightwave as we know it. Something's up, I don't care what anybody says now.

By Beam Tracer (Beamtracer) (210.50.30.20) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 03:03 pm:

No, don't worry. It only means they can't say what they're doing on their own website.

In previous posts Chuck said that Alan and Stuart are actively working on Lightwave 8, and that they're contracted to do so directly with Newtek, rather than via Luxology.

So, the guys are working away on it. That's the main thing. I think Newtek's lawyers must have stopped Luxology from making claims on its own.

If the rumors (above) are true about new character tools being developed for Lightwave, that would be very cool. It doesn't matter (at least for the Lightwave users) whether Alan and Stewart do this work under direct contracts or via their own company. The fact that development is forging ahead is the main thing.

By Larry Shultz "SplineGod" (Larrys) (216.244.12.132) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 03:22 pm:

This is the thread that neeeever ends! It just goes on and on my frieends...la la la

By Rui Feliciano (Ruifeliciano) (217.129.43.219) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 06:01 pm:

Beam,

I never read a message from Chuck saying that Alan and Stuart are actively working on LW 8 (and I believe I've read all of Chuck's messages on this subject . What Chuck said was:

- Contracts with Alan and Stuart are under way and;
- Development of LW is under way.

To me this is WAY different than saying that Alan and Stuart are working on LW 8 for Newtek which I believe we will NOT hear/read Chuck saying...

By Rui Feliciano (Ruifeliciano) (217.129.43.219) on Thursday, November 14, 2002 - 06:05 pm:

Larry,

Of course this is going to continue...it's OBVIOUS that are things going on behind the scenes that will have impact on us so people speculate when not given all the facts (and before Chuck makes another paste in here yes, I know Newtek is the sole developer of LW and all derivative products. All contracts bla, bla ;)

By Hervé Steff (Hervé) (212.76.255.97) on Friday, November 15, 2002 - 01:11 am:

Could it be a sort of (terrible I know) Lightwave 8 from Newtek vs. Lightwave 8 from Luxology...

LW vs. LW

Like in a commercial on TV

First Ha! Ha! Ha!, then, Ah! Ah!

I love those chatty chatty bang bang ..... Let's sing together Larry, 1,2,3.... la la la la

Hervé

By Chuck Baker (Cbaker) (207.235.86.2) on Friday, November 15, 2002 - 03:34 pm:

Rui, I'm hurt!

Oddly enough, I've never cut and pasted my comments on the issue. What I was saying was not that complicated. Although folks found some pretty complicated ways to interpret words that were meant quite literally....

Oh, well!



Chuck

By Rui Feliciano (Ruifeliciano) (217.129.43.219) on Friday, November 15, 2002 - 05:53 pm:

Hi Chuck,

you have to agree that it's very uncommon that someone remembers a 4 or 5 lines paragraph and is able to reproduce it at will word by word time and time again without any sort of help. Hence why I say that you use copy and paste (I'd in your situation) :-)

As to the subject well, you do know that Newtek has the powers to stop all this rumoring in a second...all it takes is to either have some representative (yep, might be you :-) say that those two folks that originally created LW for Newtek are working for you as they always have been (saying that a contract is under way means nothing as depending on people's character's/situations contracts are broken, happens all the time) or have one of them emerge and calling all of us idiots for believing that things are different from a year ago...wadda you say Chuck? Want to end this nonsense around Newtek in a second and get your clients united again instead of splitted/unconfindent as they're now? ;-)

By Ernest Miron (Ernest) (196.40.0.106) on Friday, November 15, 2002 - 06:24 pm:

It's not so strange to be able to repeat the same little paragraph over and over again if it is true, and the simplest, clearest way to say the truth.
Contracts may be broken all the time but if Newtek says that the contracts are in place, if the Luxology guys come to the Newtek forum and say that now is a great moment to get into LW, that they still love LW; if their site praises LW to no end and provides delightful LW tutorials, it doesn't seem, under any perspective, that anyone is breaking his contract. Can anything be more clear?
If on one instance someone at Luxology said that they were creating the next generation of LW, and then they took it back, we can take it to mean many things (the plugins that can be created by guys who've had access to the LW source code could very well be taken to mean a generational leap) BUT the staments given by Newtek are clear and they can have only ONE meaning and have been accepted by BOTH parts. Under the light of Newtek's staments, there is no contradiction.
If, instead of 8, they released LW7 today, I'd still consider it the best 3D SW option available. There are always more features we want but there is nothing yet that I have been able to imagine and haven't been able to create with the current version. And, no matter what happens I can continue to use it for an unlimited time. Your future is affected?? What's your specific need? What's your worry? Are you leasing LW?

By Steve White (Hrgiger) (65.24.112.98) on Friday, November 15, 2002 - 06:30 pm:

Unfortunately Rui, unless you own stock in a company (and just by owning LW, you don't), the company can choose to tell you whatever it wants. I'm sure that Newtek and Luxology have their reasons for being undisclosed at the present time, as much as I would love to know what's going on. However, having said that, I don't care if Newtek and Lux are having sleepovers with pillow and tickle fights. I'd rather know what's going on with LW8. As in, when it'll be out and what it's going to be. I think people should really give up the speculation about impending doom or greatness and also give up the notion that they're entitled to know anything about how Newtek runs it's business. Pretty much, if you don't like it, there are plenty of other 3D companies to choose from. Tim Jenison, President of Newtek, has recently made it clear that Newtek has made mistakes in the past but he believes they are on the right track now. I don't believe in Jesus myself, but I have faith that Newtek has our best interests at heart. I've seen more commitment to their customers in the last year then ever before. So quit bugging them.

By Dave Spamer (Daves) (64.57.97.42) on Friday, November 15, 2002 - 06:58 pm:

I'm speculating that they (Luxology) are developing a new modeling, animation and rendering program that will be as great as Lightwave, but 1000 times better and appeal to all of the current Lightwave users and pull in a lot of new users. I think the use of Lightwave on their site is just a way of displaying their credibility.


David

By kevin phillips (Kevman) (210.48.25.17) on Friday, November 15, 2002 - 10:59 pm:

Everyone has an assumption, a speculation, a revelation, whatever. Just because Fox Mulder was right about the aliens doesn't mean everyone else is about LightWave.

This is the song the never ends...



I'm sure Lambchop would agree...

By Zach W. (Zach) (216.239.178.31) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 05:02 am:

I was hoping that this thread would cause a stir, but I didnt' think it would go into this direction.

Sorry you guys.

Ok, the thing is, it's been since april since we had an upgrade, and that was free! yay. Free is always a good price for an upgrade. There are very few places I know of that give free upgrades to highend software that implements new things that go beyond regular bug fixes. I like that a lot. I'm of the ilk that supports the kind of "Independant spirit" that the guys at NewTek seem to care about.

The thing is, I'm just an upgrade fiend. I like to upgrade software as often as possible. Especially when they are worth while upgrades. It just seems like it's been a long time since we've gotten anything to install. Not even a bug fix update!(I still have problems loading large image files without the whole program freezing!) If not an upgrade on how the bones and kinematics work, why not update the software so it works with trivial amounts of effort.

I'm the only one in my circle of friends and acquaintances(sp?) who even boasts Lightwave. So far I haven't had any converts, but I don't expect people to see the light when I rant and rave about how kewl Lightwave is. (it just has a kewl name, if anything else, But there is way more to it than just the name for sure!) When people freak out over something with blind urgency,(like most of the users in this forum!) It's hard to take them seriously.

OK, Right now the only thing I would like in lightwave, well, ok right now there are a few things I would like to have happen in lightwave, and this is kind of redundant from when I started this evil monstorous thread...

1. Access to the vertices for animation. (please keep modeler seperate. I like the paradigm that currently exists.)

2. Faster ogl! I have a pretty good video card from 3 years ago, and certain 3D apps outperform lightwaves redraw and put it to shame. I know its got to be programming that can be cleaned up somehow.

3. It's been a long time now, and still NewTek doesn't realize that snow cones really help with the workflow. If NewTek came out with a break out box of some sort where I could make snow cones... well let me just say, that would be one feature that no one else has ever thought of... especially if there was vanilla ice cream mixed in on seperate layers.

4. Also, I'm sometimes to enibriated(sp?) to walk the dog so if NewTek could partner up with Sony or someone to make a robot that could do things like walking your dog, that would be kewl too.

5. Another kewl thing would be a button that you could press which textured your models the way you imagine them to look. Maybe if they could do something with USB 2.0 and build a psychic connection to my brain, they could corner the 3d market all together. This would be a small step to bigger psychic connections, like psychic modeling and animation.

It's really not much to ask you know. We are at the point in mans small existence in time where vanilla layered snowcones and robot dog walkers are feasable within a 3d package! I mean come on! what's the hold up!

By Will Silver (Lw_Will) (66.27.96.61) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 05:26 am:

>>3. It's been a long time now, and still NewTek doesn't realize that snow cones really help with the workflow. If NewTek came out with a break out box of some sort where I could make snow cones... well let me just say, that would be one feature that no one else has ever thought of... especially if there was vanilla ice cream mixed in on seperate layers. <<

SHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! Didn't you sign the non-ice cream declosure agreement?! Just... SHHHHHH!


Will (holding out for Orange Whip!)

By Rui Feliciano (Ruifeliciano) (217.129.43.219) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 05:34 am:

You've never read a line from me with an hypotesis on what's happening fuelling the rumors...not one. What I dispute is simply that things are not clear and that it's soooo easy for Newtek to shut up everyone that is making these rumors if they so want it. If this goes on is because they can't/want issue a press release saying so. Issuing a press release on their site costs no money and would shut up evryone including people that use other 3D soft that lately when they find people are using LW ask "Oh! But that's not being developed anymore is it?".

When Newtek was shutting down their SF offices and rumors began to spread they immediatelly shut up everyone setting the record straight in a way that no one had any further argument to continue with the issue. They also have the power to do so now if they want/can without putting Luxology or Brad into the issue...just have Stuart or Allen speak up...that's all. At this momment there're too many things that don't make sense like...Proton is such a great asset for LW's community, he's always on top of so many things and always up to date on anything LW-centered...yet I have read no mention of the Ford Entertainment Group trainning by him, for example (just one of many).

So, in resume, I don't fuel the rumors, I don't dispute Newtek's LW ownership (I just upgraded and I bought it from Newtek directly...not Luxology as Chuck knows it) but I keep saying that a lot of things are not clear and if this kind of debate goes on it's because Newtek wants it with all the implications that this has brought to LW's community.

By Rui Feliciano (Ruifeliciano) (217.129.43.219) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 05:48 am:

Ernest,
[BEGIN QUOTE]
And, no matter what happens I can continue to use it for an unlimited time. Your future is affected?? What's your specific need? What's your worry? Are you leasing LW?
[END QUOTE]

Yes you can't continue to use LW for the rest of your days even if no further development is made...as you could also use MS PAint to do your work but you choose not to for a reason. As an investor in Newtek's products (I own all of them currently being sold) I want to make sure that the bugs that hamper my day to day workflow are corrected. I want to make sure that my competitors are not able to produce better results faster and cheaper than I am because they use a better tool because mine stopped being developed. All these months without a simple bug fix (and there's so many things to just fix, not improve)and with all these non-clear "things" surrounding LW's development leave people (both actual customers and much more the potential clients) nervous to say the least.
Discreet's Edit is one of the most powerfull NLEs on the market yet people are not buying it anymore...why? Because they know there won't be any further development on it...at least this should make people think...one of the better products on the market today and people won't buy it becuase it has been discontinued...I know Newtek has said LW's development is continuing but people should bet their money on actions, not words (well..I did buy Messiah:Studio on words and I'm still waiting for a final product after I-Forgot-How-Many-Years Duh! ;-)

By Chuck Baker (Cbaker) (207.235.86.2) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 12:01 pm:

Rui, it is most certainly not the case that NewTek wants such a debate, or ever wanted such a debate. We did not create this situation, we have merely responded as we must and as is appropriate and necessary in the situation. We have responded to misinformation with correct information, and done so in the manner governed by the necessities of the situation.

NewTek's development of LightWave 3D is in progress, just as it has been for the last more than dozen years. We will be releasing the Linux render node this quarter. For the last several years we have not discussed full updates to the program before they were released, and we aren't about to change that policy now, despite the situation, so, no, I will not disclose when the next full update is coming nor other details.

You are correct that a release is the most convincing statement we would be able to make, so I trust that when we make our next release that will be all the reassurance you need.

By Jon Beck (Jbeck) (24.163.209.122) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 02:54 pm:

- "However, having said that, I don't care if Newtek and Lux are having sleepovers with pillow and tickle fights."

Frankly, I would find this a bit disturbing myself.

By Larry Shultz "SplineGod" (Larrys) (216.244.12.142) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 03:36 pm:

I look at it this way:
Every company, Every family and every person has things that happen day to day that COULD POTENTIALLY effect how they do business. Do I have to wonder if Chuck ate something this morning that could somehow effect the future of lightwave? I dont think I need to know or necessarily have the right to know a companies or an individuals internal or private business. I bought Lightwave, it works, Im happy. Too much information (released publically) can be harmful to a company and to customers. There are even laws dealing with aspects of this such as insider trading etc etc...who would have thought Martha Stewart would be caught up in it? Let Newtek work through their issues and let us know what is pertinent and relevant for us to know as customers.

By Tom Winnicki (Tom_Winnicki) (65.93.65.160) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 05:04 pm:

Relax all you edgy dudes. Good things a' comin'.

Why are some people so nosy? Firstly, if NewTek ever stopped developing LW or any of its other fine products I think they'd have the decency to inform us, especially if that product was LW. Secondly, there's no need asking for specific dates. Just look here http://personal.southern.edu/~dascott/lwhistory/index.html and if you have any intelligence you'll be able to interpolate (at least approximately) when the next major update to LW will appear. And I'm pretty sure we all understand the disadvantage that NewTek would put itself in if they disclosed information pertaining to the new feature set long before release. However, let's keep those feature requests coming [Super-Master plugin architecture... here we come] .

By Rui Feliciano (Ruifeliciano) (217.129.43.219) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 05:34 pm:

Who's asking for Newtek to disclose information pertainning to next versions of LW??
**I** would be VERY happy if they released information to shut up everybody that participates in these stupid debates (including me!) and that's far from meaning new features! (the hell with new features! I'll be happy with timely bug fixes). People are mostly afraid that the 2 original developers of LW (and apparantely one of them is the sole copyright owner of half of LW according to Modeler's about box) are gone from working on it. Prooving people that they're wrong costs Newtek nothing and if they don't do it (thus allowing these ridiculous debates to go on on every single forum that has something to do with Newtek related products and even other's that have noting to do with Newtek) is because they either can't do it or have an undisclosed reason not to. It's their business and they run it the way they can/want to...just please don't tell me that everything is crystal clear because it's not. One thing is to admit there're some issues to solve and that the interested parties (sp?)are working on them the other is to pretend everything is going the way it always have been.
This was my last public post on this subject for a while.

By Larry Shultz "SplineGod" (Larrys) (216.244.12.142) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 06:17 pm:

I personally dont care who is writing Lightwave. Alan and Stewart were and are not the only ones programming lightwave. Some of the coolest modeler stuff (metanurbs) didnt come from Stewart but from fori. A great deal of very cool stuff in layout didnt come from Alan either. As talented as Alan and Stewart are they would be the first to admit that they arent the best or most talented 3d programmers out there. Whos writing those other 3d apps out there? "Proving people wrong costs Newtek nothing" is an assumption. Again, since we dont know whats going on any assumptions we make about what Newtek, Luxology, Alan and Stewart can or cannot safely disclose is a complete and probably wrong assumption. Crystal clear...Of all the statments Ive seen by Newtek, Luxology or Alan and Stewart, Chucks statments have been the most crystal clear.

By Steve White (Hrgiger) (65.24.112.98) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 07:50 pm:

Word Larry. I could care less if Sadaam Hussein was writing the next version of Lightwave as long as it's good.

By stephen gilbert (Cresshead) (62.254.0.4) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 08:11 pm:

'Word Larry. I could care less if Sadaam Hussein was writing the next version of Lightwave as long as it's good'.......


well going by a documentry i saw on iraq and SH
the newtek logo would have to change to a likeness if his worship!

and seeing as there's a competition for a new logo..well you never know!...maybe the interface would have to change to icons...all of which would be different angles of SH!...work those out!

cheers

steve g

By Steve White (Hrgiger) (65.24.112.98) on Saturday, November 16, 2002 - 08:21 pm:

Ooh, that's true Stephen.

By Hervé Steff (Hervé) (212.76.255.97) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 02:30 am:

He he, according to the last issue of 3D world (with a copy of LW on the CD), LightWave is not the extra competitor in the 3D big boys arena.... Sofimage XSI 3,0 is now the best all around software, and in fact they say there is only 2 compet. right now, Maya Vs Sofimage, period.

Funny fact.... a guy named Will Mendez (ouh la la, no offenses Will, sigh... its a joke OK.... a joke, just kidding OK ?) "sold his soul" to the demon.... after doing ads for Newtek showing his LW tatoos (version 5.6 & 6.0), he became a ..... XSI3.0 evangelist, (yes a little like you William, but for the opposite camp) so in the latest 3D world issue, he's showing now his XSI logo tatoo, saying as soon he touched XSI, he knew this would be THE APP of his life.... I hope for him nobody comes with another terrific 3D app.

it makes me remind of an old cartoon, where the guy had so many crossed out girl names....


Like the commercial ad stated (for those interested last cover of NewTekniques March/April & July/August 2000) :

" It's not about attention, it's about beliefs"


but the best ever ad of NT was in the same paper for the video toaster " Compression Sucks !"

Allez, comme on dit en France, "... à la tienne !"

Hervé
(so Will, I'ts a joke, huh remember, OK ?)

By Emmanuel Henne (Emmanuel) (212.144.31.18) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 04:23 am:

It really bugs me that the Toaster software is updated so often
A little maintenance update every three months would be really cool.
They could raise the price for the soft by 295 bucks or so and declare this a maintenace fee.

If I follow the development cycles, the next one should appear end 2002...

By Rui Feliciano (Ruifeliciano) (217.129.43.219) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 04:43 am:

Emmanuel,

It upsets you that the Toaster is being updated so often? I hope the powers that be don't hear you say that! At least one of the products gets the deserved attention! BIG kudos for Newtek's Toaster development team for timely bug fixes! Buh! for LW's...

By Iggy Snowboard (Isnowboard) (61.211.21.98) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 04:51 am:

I bought LW 7.5. I'm not ready for LW 8 yet.

1. Will there be a point upgrade before LW 8 is released?

1a. If there is, will it be free for registered owners of 7.5?

2. When LW 8 does come out, is it going to be in the $395 to $495 price range again?

By Beam Tracer (Beamtracer) (210.50.30.22) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 04:54 am:

Luxology claimed they owned Lightwave, were developing the next version, and Newtek was merely the publisher.

As we know, Newtek hotly disputes this. Newtek asserts that it owns Lightwave and is the sole developer. Most people on this forum have accepted Newtek's response.

Of course this is a legal dispute. The fact that neither party can talk openly means the dispute is ongoing.

Judging by the nervous responses from those posting messages on this forum, Newtek needs to stem the bleeding before it affects sales too much. The longer this drags on the more damage it does. Unfortunately disputes don't tend to resolve quickly.

I guess it's better to have 2 companies fight over who will develop a product than have nobody wanting to develop it.

By arthur argote (Archiea) (66.32.159.129) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 05:31 am:

There's been enough information given for people to read between the lines. No sense in trying to crowbar answers out of NT or anybody. Very interesting that the topic was brought up in the recent issue of keyframe magazine. I think david Warner summed up the cause for all of the confusion quite planly...

By Larry Shultz "SplineGod" (Larrys) (216.244.13.50) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 06:11 am:

I think outside of these forums that not that many people generally know or care about this issue.

By Andy Lackow (Craftmatic) (4.35.92.165) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 10:58 am:

Outside of these forums everyone is pissing and moaning about their own particular app of choice. It seems to have calmed down now, but you should have heard the bitching on Discreet's forum when the forum manager was let go or when they announced that they wouldn't lower the price on 3ds max, refusing to follow the "desperate" trend of the competition (Maya & LW). Every so often someone starts a "maybe Maya is better than max" thread (just like the "Maya is Better than LW" threads that pop up here). The one that started at the max forum, after the Maya price slash, was so incendiary that the forum manager deleted the whole thing. Then someone posted how much sh*t was hitting the fan at the Maya forums because owners were fearing that A|W was was going bankrupt and having a fire sale or pissed because some paid the full $7500 before the price drop. It's almost like all 3D users are rebellious, pouting children angry at their 3D vendor parents. If you're all so unhappy with LW, then buy ALL of the programs and then you can be four times as unhappy! LW is an amazing program - there is no real, tangible sign that it is in danger. Just use it, enjoy it and make great art and forget about the rumor mill. (Sorry, I just had to get that off my chest - rant off.)

By Beam Tracer (Beamtracer) (210.50.30.20) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 02:50 pm:

I don't hate Lightwave. I love it! I think that Maya and Max are definitely not better.

I wonder, in hindsight, whether it would have been better for Newtek to let Luxology go on and continue making their claims about Lightwave. Newtek could always have disputed them behind the scenes, but allowed Luxology to say what they wanted publicly. Luxology are a bunch of Lightwave evangelists, and they always say things about Lightwave that feel inspiring. Disputing them publicly may make people worry more.

I do however wish that Newtek would resolve whatever issues or disagreements it has with Luxology quickly. One way or another. Avoid prolonged disputes at any cost.

I mean, we could pick on the achilles heals of every 3D company, as they all have one. I'd recommend Lightwave to anyone aspiring to get into 3D, and I do recommend it. I tell them the reasons why LW is better than the above mentioned applications. Development of Lightwave continues, and I look forward to the release of the Linux renderer, as well as the new character tools headed for the next release.

By Chuck Baker (Cbaker) (66.69.70.123) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 03:06 pm:

Hi, Beam!

Unfortunately, what you suggest would not be a workable solution in the circumstances. Direct copyright ownerships and contractual holdings have to be defended openly to be maintained. This is an obligation, not something optional.

Chuck

By Beam Tracer (Beamtracer) (210.50.30.20) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 05:03 pm:

Thanks, Chuck. That answers many questions.

By arthur argote (Archiea) (66.32.159.129) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 05:20 pm:

I think NT had every right to dispute it. I think it was a bit premature of Luxology to make its claims. It appears that since Alan and Stuat were the founders of Luxology that it was assumed by all that Luxology was now involved in Lightwave.

I think the confusion by us customers is that their appears to be a conflict of interest. The head developers of a piece of software start their own company in a similar field, but are contractually obligated to another company.

Its like I went to go work for disney, yet I start my own 3D animation company. So while I'm the lead animator at disney, I have my own company that first claimed to do Diseny animated features (if only by association), and then without retracting that statement, changed my company's mission to provide schooling for disney animators. While I'm sure that I'd be a good employee at disney, I doubt myheart would be as into it if I didn't have my own company. This is why at studios like disney you have conracts that stipulate against this.

the fact is that we are ignorant to the true facts, which makes our assumptions, including mine, no better than some tabloid celebrity gossip show on E!. Its clear that there was some bad blood between the two, but we are powerless othr than to support NT with upgrades and so forth.

I have a greater concern for the lowering of the cost of LW. Companies like Discreet and so forth, you knew that their money went into some exec's pocket. Lw's $2500 price enabled (I'm guessing) that sanfransico office to be open, along with supporting inhouse projects like the Freak and training. I'm not downplaying NT's current efforts at all, I just see less money at NT affecting their ability to serve us. There didn't seem to be alot of fat at NT. When Discreet restructured this past year, they tossed alot of middle managment and some top brass. They really restructured. They had alot of fat to remove.

I just hope that with LW's current price point, and the market as well, that there is enough of a business to be had out there...

By Beam Tracer (Beamtracer) (210.50.30.20) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 05:44 pm:

I think most Lightwave users have always just assumed and accepted that Newtek is the developer of Lightwave, while at the same time having a curiosity as to what Luxology is up to. Luxology doesn't seem to think it needs to defend things publicly, having removed their previous claims from their website, however they may have done that to avoid litigation.

My own impression of goings on (as an outsider and Lightwave user) is that Arnie Cachelin (a talented software engineer who remains with Newtek) was some months ago promoted to a more senior position within Newtek, overseeing software development. I guess he's so busy overseeing the development of the next version of Lightwave that he doesn't have much time to post on these forums any more.

At the same time I get the impression that Newtek was and maybe still is hiring new software engineers to work on developing Lightwave. The obvious assumption is that these would be to fill the void of some defectors to the Luxology camp.

From the point of view of users, I think everyone would really like to know what is happening, despite some people claiming to be bored of the topic (I think they would really like to know too.) It's just natural curiosity. I think it would affect the companies involved more than the users. Which ever way it goes, one company loses out.

However, both companies have proven themselves to be very capable of developing software products, so Lightwave progresses regardless.

By Rui Feliciano (Ruifeliciano) (217.129.43.219) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 07:00 pm:

(ok, I'm biting my tongue...again!)

Beam,

[BEGIN QUOTE]
However, both companies have proven themselves to be very capable of developing software products, so Lightwave progresses regardless.
[END QUOTE]

To this date what Luxology has proven is that they can stir the LW community and then hide back under the the stones they've come from since they changed their attitude 180º from being a mouthful company that will do this and that and bla, bla to one of the most silent companies I've known...they've released nothing so far besides a very neat web site regarding LW so as far as their capability of releasing products I guess we'll still have to wait in order to form any kind of judgement.

However if they're really developing something it shouldn't take them that long with so many people on board...let's just hope it's good and with timely updates...does anyone remember the flagship of L6's release? The super-hyper-mega new architecture that would allow new features and bug fixes to happen with unprecedent speed? yeah...right!

[I really hate my self for replying to this stuff!]

By Timothy M. (Cim) (205.188.208.43) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 08:11 pm:

Newtek is the one to blame here. They're not being truthful to the Lightwave community. Luxology slipped an revealed to much of Lightwave's development, so now Newtek is creating bs. to try to make up for it. Newtek is using business talk to try an explain what they're doing, which only confuses ppl. more.

For those who can't put two-and-two together: NT is using it's own developers, along with those at Luxology to develop future versions of LW--just as it has been for a long time now. Only thing different is that Allen and Stuart have formed their own little company.

By Steve White (Hrgiger) (65.24.112.98) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 08:58 pm:

Wow, what a bunch of dumb speculation...
Timothy, Newtek is to blame for what? There is no situation. Newtek is not being untruthful. They haven't lied to anyone. Nobody owes you an explanation of what's going on. If they seem evasive, maybe it's because they're are legal matters at hand, or maybe it's a business decision. You could think that lightwave users could show a little more support for Newtek and it's product Lightwave. Timothy, telling people what's going on when you don't know anything, putting two and two together as you say, is the real bs here and the only one confusing people here is you.


From what Herve said above...
If 3D world thinks that Softimage is now the best all around software, then it's stuffing it's magazine with crack and smoking it. It might be a great piece of software, but who the hell can afford it? Yeah, what a great deal, I give them my lightwave and $3500 and I get softimage. $5,000. What a bargain. That's not all around software.

By Larry Shultz "SplineGod" (Larrys) (216.244.21.71) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 10:07 pm:

So a BUSINESS is using BUSINESS talk to explain what theyre doing...and thats bad because... ?

Lets see...Brad Peebler leaves Newtek and suddenly forms new company. New company says things in public they later have to retract. Newtek says things and hasnt changed their stance. How does that make Newtek to blame?

It seems to me that Newteks only responsibilit to talk about Newtek. Why is up to Newtek to explain Luxology?
Fori, who is one of the co-founders of PMG used to work for Newtek. Is Newtek responsible to answer for whatever PMG says about Messiah?
Many people have left Newtek to go their own ways over the years. Is Newtek responsible to answer for them? If Chuck were to leave Newtek, form his own company and claim he was Tim Jennsion would Newtek be responsible for his statements?

By Adam Jeffries (Zithen) (24.205.95.5) on Sunday, November 17, 2002 - 10:50 pm:

From CGchannel's interview with Amaan Akram

"CGC: What do you think of Luxology?

AA: Actually I am not in a position to comment on Luxology. The team there is great for sure. Everyone in the lightwave world knows the people at Luxology by their names. But I don't know what or how Luxology intends to work for the future of Lightwave. I am sure whatever they will do, it will be for the advancement of the tool."

Like Chuck said, Luxology has nothing to do with Lightwave. I am getting the impression that whatever they're doing...they're on their own, as in "independent technology company." I mean, if all those programmers aren't working for Newtek, then what program could they be coding for?
Who knows...?

By Ernest Miron (Ernest) (196.40.0.106) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 12:14 am:

I had avoided posting again in this thread hoping it would die but since it keeps coming up I'll answer your question for me Rui... no, I don't use MSPaint and I don't use it for the reason that it was never ever a usable product. I do however continue to use Photoshop4.5. If adobe ever releases a new version that allows me to create better art, I'll upgrade. I upgraded LW 5 to 6 because it allowed me to create better art. I upgraded LW 6 to 7 because I could drag the subpatch vertices instead of points and that allowed me to create art faster. I had max 3 but I never upgraded to 4 or 5 because, having LW, it didn't allow me to create better or faster art even with upgrades.
Having LW doesn't really affect your future decision. If LW8 comes out and it costs $150,000 with 0% discount to current owners and it's worth it and will return your investment in a week, you upgrade; if LW8 costs $10 for current users but something else allows you to create better or faster art with comparable customer service to LW's then someone would have created something increeedibly good and that would be good for you too. If LW8 is no good and nobody else makes anything better, I'll be happy to continue to use LW7 because there is nothing I want to create that I can't create with it.
So my art creating is not affected by this issue. If you won't be satisfied with any other answer but "the IS a conspiracy and Lux will take over the world" save your breath. If it was true lawyers and other dark, obscure creatures wouldn't allow anyone to admit it and if it is not true then they have been saying the truth all this time in a hundred posts.
So I see no reason to torture these very nice people who have been answering the same question again and again. Even Walt Disney showed that his patience had a limit and I don't want to see the atmosphere around here change. Please don't make that happen for something that is not worth it.
...unless you ARE leasing LW...

By Hervé Steff (Hervé) (212.76.255.97) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 12:23 am:

You holly poeple are really intoo it..... duh... funny boys...

By Chuck Baker (Cbaker) (207.235.86.2) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 10:11 am:

Hi, Timothy!

Are you also CIM on CGTalk? I think that's the case, but if not please excuse me - I'm going to reply as though it is the case. Between the posts here and on CGTalk, you've stated that NewTek is not being forthcoming and is changing what we say. Neither of these assertions is founded. I have personally made pretty much every one of the responses from NewTek on the topic, and the message has been so consistent that most folks are convinced I've been just cutting and pasting for months now.

It is also the case that what we've had to say is perfectly straightforward and forthcoming, and literally true. Untrue statements regarding the rights involved in LightWave 3D and the development of LightWave 3D were made by a company with which we have no relationship and without consulting NewTek. We were obligated to correct that misinformation to protect our exclusive rights, and we have done so and continue to do so. We have done so with clear, concise, and to-the-point language.

By Matt Clary (Mattclary) (208.255.196.53) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 10:58 am:

I'm not clear, what are you trying to imply, Chuck? Just kidding.

By Steve White (Hrgiger) (65.24.112.98) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 11:20 am:

Timohty,

How can you definately say that Newtek is being the dishonest one or confusing one and not Luxology? Maybe because Luxology gives you more the answer you want to hear?

By Karl Hansson (Karl) (217.208.3.35) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 12:05 pm:

I love this thread

By brad gordon (Anim8r) (12.101.14.2) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 12:52 pm:

Chuck,

Just remember that the rumor mongers make up a SMALL minority and are only a nuisance.

I couldn't believe that people actually think we didn't go to the moon and some people really believe the earth is flat. And there are some people that believe if you buy a Superman costume, you can actually fly.

Nothing (absolutely nothing) anyone says or demonstrates will change the minds (ever) of people who can actually come these conclusions after getting the facts.

If you feel like you've been taking crazy pills, it's OK. I felt that way for quite a while. Now I just accept the fact that some people can not follow a straight path, no matter how hard you hold their hands.


And I'm with you Karl. These threads are shear entertainment to me.

By david maas (Dobermunk) (217.230.176.126) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 01:48 pm:

Who needs TV?
Chuck, have you thought of selling this as a reality format?

By Mike Foy (Kingslugg) (66.47.191.138) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 01:53 pm:

We didn't go to the moon.

By brad gordon (Anim8r) (12.101.14.2) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 03:23 pm:

Hopefully you're kidding (or just misinformed).

If you're not kidding and have attended at least one high school physics class, visit:

http://liftoff.msfc.nasa.gov/news/2001/news-moonlanding.asp

Check out the "Bad Astronomy" link.

(But, I'm sure you're just joking. Right?)

By Chris Moschella (Chris_M) (12.101.14.2) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 03:34 pm:

Brad, if by "we" he means you, himself, and me, then he is correct, "we" didn't go to the moon. But if he is referring to the Apollo astronauts, then he would be incorrect =]

By Digital Freak (Trilogy) (203.31.48.224) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 04:06 pm:

Can i buy the rights to the Book & Animated series? (Done in Maya of course)

Waves of our Lives: The Newtek / Luxology story.

Who REALLY owns the rights to LW3D.

Does Chuck Baker really exist?

Does Hypeology actually do anything?

Why does Luxology sponsor the Newtek roadshow?

Lightwave 8 is not Mecca.

Where have all the programmers gone.
(Sing along with Brad chapter)

Read the comments, that got Luxology into trouble
with the law.

Find out how both companies have been lying.

Is BP's EGO bigger than Jesus?

Bonus Chapter: Learn how light is infanite, but the Mayans died out.
-------------------------------------------------

Just some of the chapters in Waves of our Lives:
The Hypeology Conspiracy (working Title)

More chapters are coming.....

To be published by Mills & Boon, in December 2002
ISBN: 446554674576
(Look for Maya PLE on the cover) ;)

By brad gordon (Anim8r) (12.101.14.2) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 04:24 pm:

ROFL!!

By Burton R. Ogden (Burton) (172.174.151.35) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 05:20 pm:

I am curious what all those former LightWave programmers over at Luxology are getting in the way of paychecks and who is paying them. With no product on the market and no visible means of support, their financial situation seems a bit precarious to me.

By Karl Hansson (Karl) (217.208.3.35) on Monday, November 18, 2002 - 05:22 pm:

"...Does Chuck Baker really exist?

Does Hypeology actually do anything?

Why does Luxology sponsor the Newtek roadshow?

Lightwave 8 is not Mecca.

Where have all the programmers gone.
(Sing along with Brad chapter)..."

I think the man on the moon has got something to do with it... The truth is out there... Thats the missing X-file...

By Mike Foy (Kingslugg) (66.47.191.138) on Tuesday, November 19, 2002 - 10:35 am:

We never landed on the moon.

By Karl Hansson (Karl) (217.208.3.35) on Tuesday, November 19, 2002 - 10:43 am:

yep the biggest scam in the history

By brad gordon (Anim8r) (12.101.14.2) on Tuesday, November 19, 2002 - 11:19 am:

I wonder why people never want to read anymore (and at the same time why believe people believe the craziest consiracy theories without question). There are generally two ways at drawing a conclusion in today's society; read just a portion of the tomes of factual data concerning this issue and learn, or watch an easy-to-disprove sensationalistic conspiracy TV show and eat every morsel up. Funny how many people would rather do the latter.

As the fictional character Fox Mulder once said, "The proof is out there."

Of course, this implies people are actually looking...

And in this case, it's not only out there, it's WELL documented and supported by the world's (world's) leading scientists (not just the USA, or the "republicans".) And the physics discussed (as well as the basics of photography) are easy enough to follow for most ninth graders (most of this data is supported by pictures and simple experiments). It really is simple (really). But, you MUST be willing to read.

Amazing that some will believe documentaries at face value from the same network that did "When Animals Attack".

O.K. I'm done, once again I have to accept the fact that some people can not follow a straight path, no matter how hard you hold their hands. And I just can't hold on any harder than this.

By Karl Hansson (Karl) (217.208.3.35) on Tuesday, November 19, 2002 - 11:50 am:

Im just pulling you chain. I have no idea whether there was a moonlanding or not. Im really not interested in the matter. But it would be cool if all this turns out to be the biggest scam in the history.

By Karl Hansson (Karl) (217.208.3.35) on Tuesday, November 19, 2002 - 11:54 am:

LOL this thread moves in strange ways. What was the topic again...?

By brad gordon (Anim8r) (12.101.14.2) on Tuesday, November 19, 2002 - 12:13 pm:

You guys kill me.

Sadly, there are people that actually believe the hoaxsters (and crop circles, and the alien autopsy, etc.). So, it's hard to see sarcasm when it's written.

Anyway, it was fun (as always). I really do like the conspiracy threads. Funny how all LW upgrade discussions bring up the L-word and then all hell breaks loose.

By Cori Bucklin (Scratchnsniff) (216.26.16.197) on Tuesday, November 19, 2002 - 12:23 pm:

Karl,

The topic is : Is Chuck Baker really a operative for Luxology named Sadaam Hussein?

Unfortunately, we may never know. The truth is probably too complicated for any of us to understand, anyway.

Regardless, the thread marches on .

By Richard Stallsmith (Lwaddict) (63.125.144.5) on Tuesday, November 19, 2002 - 02:31 pm:

Still,
there's much to do with Chupa Cabras over at the Lux building.

They come at night when no one's looking,
steal from your innerds,
and disappear leaving only trace evidence
that it ever happened.

Deny deny deny, as they will.

It will all come out in the end.

In the meantime...the unstoppable thread pushes onward!!!

By Burton R. Ogden (Burton) (172.174.252.193) on Tuesday, November 19, 2002 - 04:06 pm:

I thought what Fox Mulder said was, "The truth is out there." Which could be interpreted as meaning that it isn't here. [grin]

By brad gordon (Anim8r) (12.101.14.2) on Tuesday, November 19, 2002 - 04:57 pm:

I thought maybe, he had a lisp and he was trying to say proof. hehe

By Ted wolf (Tawolf) (67.1.64.204) on Tuesday, January 28, 2003 - 08:06 pm:

I have been using LW3d since LW4, I am very proud of how Newtek has grown over the years and the support, tutorials and fine forums they have made available to those of us who are not full time guro's or artisans of the "upper strata".

Having said that, I really would like to see some Improvement in either the existing manuals and if not that, the "new version".

I am currently using 7.5, and since I did not come from "On High" as some of my fellow 7.5 users have, I find it often a rather large challenge finding help from the 1200 page manual (sliders for example).

I believe there are more regular users out here than there are "Heavy Hitters" and probably we do more to promote the solid product that NewTek has engineered and marketed.

I am doing such work for a small mining school as we speak, there is so much interest from the staff that they would like me to lectures on the product.

P.S. They were not aware of the product before I started working with them "Where is Marketing????"

By Jessica Vitale (Jvitale) (209.179.130.119) on Tuesday, January 28, 2003 - 09:39 pm:

William Vaughan has vowed to work on the White Elephant that is the manual...and I believe him...He is the best thing that has happened to LightWave...one of the hings that he has vowed to change is to include color pictures...Hurray..

By Beam Tracer (Beamtracer) (203.109.241.109) on Tuesday, January 28, 2003 - 10:34 pm:

"I hereby take this solemn vow that I will use color pictures"

Actually, I never thought of the need for color pictures in the manual. It would look pretty, but add to the cost, which would be passed on to users.

By chris golchert (Cgolchert) (208.188.17.204) on Tuesday, January 28, 2003 - 11:06 pm:

There is a need for color images when the text tells you to look at the "blue line in the image."

By Vince Lebish (Lebish) (205.188.208.43) on Wednesday, January 29, 2003 - 05:36 am:

I got one thing to add to this..

Are we forgetting LightWave is already chalked full of everthing and anything to do anything already..and I bet that 95 percent of every one that talks crap, are just lazey animators with no inspiration..

forinstance.. I jumped on in version 5.6 and since then.. my head has been spinnning on the eternal quest of figuring out and really understanding, still only, maybe 80%? But I can tell you this much,

" Maya Eat my Shorts "

Because once you can grip up Motion Designer..
Then go on to master Motion Mixer..
production animation is a breeze...

After seeing Jimmy Neutron.. I was so inspired.. to be as successful.. that I have most of my characters modeled..



Most of them even have dynamic hair, that works fabulous.. and some of them have a super wide range of facial expressions.. and even built in HMOT motions, such as walks, jumps, ect. ect.. and all I have to do is drive them around with Motion Mixer..and twiddle some morphs...
and it almost becomes a video game..

NOw... I don't know much of other apps.. but I don't know how anyone can go about makeing menus better, on account that, this is probably the best way to put this much stuff together at once.. with this much control.. and it is about control.. if you don't want control.. go buy bryce...or poser..poser..

By Vince Lebish (Lebish) (205.188.208.43) on Wednesday, January 29, 2003 - 05:39 am:

Ok..

By Vince Lebish (Lebish) (205.188.208.43) on Wednesday, January 29, 2003 - 05:42 am:

I give up..

By Will Silver (Lw_Will) (66.27.96.238) on Wednesday, January 29, 2003 - 07:45 am:

Look at your "/" Lebish!

So... Jessica. Does that mean we should or could talk about that ReallyCoolThing^tm that William and Deuce showed at the LA Lightwave Users Group meeting in January? Huh? Huh?

Will

"Welcome, Welcome my Friend; To the Thread that Never Ends."

By Timothy J Alt (Groodwanderer) (129.101.4.119) on Wednesday, January 29, 2003 - 04:00 pm:

NIce images Lebish. LOL! Not that i should laugh i've never tried to post an image.

By Dustin D'Amour (Wizcraker) (68.99.218.128) on Wednesday, January 29, 2003 - 05:00 pm:

"So... Jessica. Does that mean we should or could talk about that ReallyCoolThing^tm that William and Deuce showed at the LA Lightwave Users Group"

Thats the nice thing about User Groups. It is actually a public event, if someone at a company wants to leak information it is impossible to control where that information goes from there. So for you keeping whatever information about some new feature or whatever to your self is crazy. Share the knowledge to customers who do not live near by a city to have the oppurtunity to go to these so called User Groups.

By arthur argote (Archiea) (68.164.58.150) on Wednesday, January 29, 2003 - 10:43 pm:

Will,

I suggest that you leak nothing. its no big deal really as far as issues with competators or anything, but we promised Newtek and we should respect that. especially considering how closed lid they are in general...