Fryrender Ext. Test

[roger1972]

Hi!!

just wanted to show off my first exterior rendered with fryrender...
just love this renderer

[dballesg]

Incredible! :)

Where you take the photo? :devil:

[clumsycloudy]

cool, looks like MIR has competition now. How long was your setup time and how long to fry till crisp? Any post? Do you find the material editor to be intuitive?

ric

[roger1972]

rendered over night on a dualcore intel.. 3000x1800 px...
the materials is more less the same as in maxwell... no post-prod.. just the grass in front ogf the building... the imageplanes got ****** to big UV map.. but i'm rendering a new one tonight with a perfect lawn (a bit too perfect, so I'm going to destroy it a bit with my tablet :-) )

[roger1972]

and the trees are Onyx-trees that i made, with leaves from my backyard :-)

[clumsycloudy]

They got you photographing leafs hehe..

i think mapping is a bit of a problem, hope they will give control over that in the next beta, i'm constantly resizing in 6 different slots. Do you texture at all in lightwave or just apply a blank mapping with a consistent size? And have you been able to displace along an edge in fry? Seems it only displaces from its normal..

[roger1972]

They got you photographing leafs hehe..

i think mapping is a bit of a problem, hope they will give control over that in the next beta, i'm constantly resizing in 6 different slots. Do you texture at all in lightwave or just apply a blank mapping with a consistent size? And have you been able to displace along an edge in fry? Seems it only displaces from its normal..

I texture all in LW so I can give right size on panels etc.. activate fry-render material an make material from LW-surface. then i get the right size of the UV-map. then i go over to the material-mixer in fry and set the material bump, displacement.. etc...

[clumsycloudy]

happy frying roger! Btw cool site you got, i like the helicopter shadow in the birdseye animation.. :)

[roger1972]

happy frying roger! Btw cool site you got, i like the helicopter shadow in the birdseye animation.. :)

we had to put the shadow on the CG because we flew with the sun in our back when we filmed this clip... so the shadow is real...

[clumsycloudy]

my mistake, hehe

[roger1972]

:-)

[glebe digital]

Really nice job, the light-matching is spot on.

[Bluesilver]

Hi Roger,

How did you get this focus in your image ? I mean, everything in focus and no visible DOF. Have you autofocused from Fryrender camera panel or have you increased f-stop value from LW's camera panel ? I tried to get same result in your image but always ended with a big DOF.

[Bluesilver]

Hi again,

Is there an option to disable Camera's DOF effect in Fryrender ?

[clumsycloudy]

**** nvrmnd

[clumsycloudy]

Hi again,

Is there an option to disable Camera's DOF effect in Fryrender ?

Have you changed it in LW or fry, since it mostly forgets these things when exporting, you should be able to render without any noticable DOF unless you cover a great distance with your camera.. F stop works for me..

You probably know you can switch of autofocus and set the focus point in the real time viewer in fry (focus button, drag focus plane), after that press the hold camera button to incorporate changes to camera.

ric

[ingo]

Nice hyperrealistic rendering, but the material is not clearly "visible". I guess it should be red painted wood but it looks like metal. Are the hedges made with Onyx too ?

[roger1972]

the hedges is made with onyx... and the walls is painted wood... and you get an effect like this with painted wood... maybe i overdid it just to make it a bit more flashy :-)

[Iain]

That does look like Mir. I would have just assumed it was LW or FPrime.
Lovely render regardless.
:thumbsup:

[bjornkn]

Excuse my ignorance, but what is Mir?

Nice render BTW :)

[Iain]

A Norwegian LW studio who specialise in arch viz.

www.mir-visuals.com

[roger1972]

I would say that we are not on their level, but tanx anyway

[bjornkn]

Thanks!
Guess I should've have known that - in my own little country?
Nice to see that such a company is using LW instead of Max and Vray:)

BTW, Fryrender looks good, but the (lack of?) speed concerns me. Is it at all possible to use it for producing renderings given the "normal" deadlines (which usually seems to be if it could be finished by yesterday ;)?
And how about for animations/flythroughs/walk-throughs?

[roger1972]

That does look like Mir. I would have just assumed it was LW or FPrime.
Lovely render regardless.
:thumbsup:

I have no problem making this in LW-fprime... but LW does not have instancing, thats why i use Fryrender...

[clumsycloudy]

could it be Mir got the fryrender beta a few years before we did?

[wavk]

i find it amazing what MIR pulls off with the lw render and fprime.

as if it even isnt fprime or lw.

just amazing looks, materials and compositions.

i could use some of their tricks.. :)


mlon

[clumsycloudy]

how about that update you promissed roger?

[roger1972]

i find it amazing what MIR pulls off with the lw render and fprime.

as if it even isnt fprime or lw.

just amazing looks, materials and compositions.

i could use some of their tricks.. :)


mlon

you could try to use a lot of blurred reflections.. 4 bounce radiosity and a backdrop hdr sky + a big arealight sun... that would fix a lot.

[Iain]

Their renders are heavily post processed too. Nothing wrong with that of course.

[roger1972]

Their renders are heavily post processed too. Nothing wrong with that of course.

not at all... but i prefer to make everything 3d. so when a customer wants changes I could just send it into the farm and take it out tomorrow.. :-)

but my big problem allways have been the nature.. you have to postprocess that if you don't have a rendrerer that does not support instancing...

[Iain]

but my big problem allways have been the nature.. you have to postprocess that if you don't have a rendrerer that does not support instancing...

I'll second that.

It's coming Roger, or so they keep telling us..................

[ingo]

......but my big problem allways have been the nature.. you have to postprocess that if you don't have a rendrerer that does not support instancing...

Why ? My scenes are always full of 3D trees/hedges/bushes and render fine, although instancing would be a big plus. I always wondered why cloning isn't automaticly instancing in LW.

[vpii]

The problem is even if Newtek does finally support instance, something HD does fine you are stuck with Lightwave render engine. I wish worley would make one to work with fprime.

[roger1972]

Why ? My scenes are always full of 3D trees/hedges/bushes and render fine, although instancing would be a big plus. I always wondered why cloning isn't automaticly instancing in LW.

I make trees with 300.000,- polys one bit of my hedge is 200.000 polys

10 trees 3 mill polys... 20 bits of hedges... 4. mill polys...

arc design houses etc... 500.000

OUT OF MEMORY!!! :-)

[roger1972]

The problem is even if Newtek does finally support instance, something HD does fine you are stuck with Lightwave render engine. I wish worley would make one to work with fprime.

agree... I dream about that... making a huge forest with billions of hi quality instanced trees using 500 mbytes memory :-)

[vpii]

If worley wrote fprime for Vue, I would be tempted to do all work there. Maybe copy the way Lightwave does surfacing and the combo would be a winner.

[roger1972]

If worley wrote fprime for Vue, I would be tempted to do all work there. Maybe copy the way Lightwave does surfacing and the combo would be a winner.

agree! that would been an EVIL solution :-)

but I could use a instance painter, like the one in vue. that would be very nice to have in LW. Just plug in the wacom and go bananas with painting instances...
and maybe a plant library that could mix different species straight in to a groundplane :-)

[bjornkn]

So how do you make that lawn, Roger? Is that post-processed, front projection, or some other trick? There is a slightly different texture around the hedges on the right side, which looks a bit repetitive, but apart from that it looks very natural.
Lots of nice details on your buildings, with curtains etc, and it even looks like you have modeled every single board on the wall sidings?
But that drain pipe from the roof would never be "certified" by the authoritites, ending there up in the air ;)

What is it that makes the instancing in Fry better than HD_Instance?
Can you spray some points in modeler and let Fry replace each one with instances, and can you use weight maps tp control density? And do you have "jitter" on rotations, scaling etc?
I love HD_Instance combined with the new interpolated GI options. FPrime is nice too, but it takes ages to do grain-free interiors with it - and then you lose the instancing too...

[vpii]

At the moment I use spray points in modeler or just points for single plants. I use VueExport2 plugin for exact placment in vue. There are also some custom scripts he has wrote also to help in this. If you vue this works good so far.

http://lightfreeze.freeforums.org/index.php

[ingo]

I make trees with 300.000,- polys one bit of my hedge is 200.000 polys

10 trees 3 mill polys... 20 bits of hedges... 4. mill polys...

arc design houses etc... 500.000

OUT OF MEMORY!!! :-)

So lets see if i can compete ;)

trees are around 130.000 polys, hedge is between 50.000 and 200.000 polys, depending on the length (i use both types of hedges, premodelled and specially for the project modelled hedges only made with leafes).

I use mostly two trees close to the camera or where 3D is needed, the rest are clipmapped renderings of those trees.

House designs are mostly 50.000 to 150.000 polys.

So overall between 1.000.000 and 3.000.000 polys.

Out of memory, never heard of it ;) But all those clipmapped leaves can kill a renderer for sure.

[roger1972]

So lets see if i can compete ;)

trees are around 130.000 polys, hedge is between 50.000 and 200.000 polys, depending on the length (i use both types of hedges, premodelled and specially for the project modelled hedges only made with leafes).

I use mostly two trees close to the camera or where 3D is needed, the rest are clipmapped renderings of those trees.

House designs are mostly 50.000 to 150.000 polys.

So overall between 1.000.000 and 3.000.000 polys.

Out of memory, never heard of it ;) But all those clipmapped leaves can kill a renderer for sure.

then you have to render 64-bits LW...

[ingo]

then you have to render 64-bits LW...

No its still 32Bit, and afaik there is still no 64Bit version for the Mac available.

[tektonik]

in lw 9.2 and with the 1.8 demo of fryrender i cannot create a fryrender camera... says the plugin is not the right version anyone had that bug ?

must 1 use LW9.3 ?

does fryrender support nodes ?

[Pavlov]

Roger what do you mean with "too big UV for grass" ?
If i understand your problem - i had this in hte past - remember that Fry exports just one projection type for each material, and it's taken from first layer of color texture. If you have Y planar texture in Lw, Fry will create an UV corresponding to that, taking the whole plane. You have to raise UV tiling values in Fry texture and you'll get exactly same result as LW.

Paolo

[roger1972]

Roger what do you mean with "too big UV for grass" ?
If i understand your problem - i had this in hte past - remember that Fry exports just one projection type for each material, and it's taken from first layer of color texture. If you have Y planar texture in Lw, Fry will create an UV corresponding to that, taking the whole plane. You have to raise UV tiling values in Fry texture and you'll get exactly same result as LW.

Paolo

I made a plane with a UV-map , put a grass texture on that, and made the grass tesxture repeat it self 6 times in x (texture facing z), then i pointcloned the plane like 200 times in modeler. but when i exported it from LW-layout the repeating on the texture on thel planes was not eksported, so i forgot to adjust the repeating in fryrender... (if you understood something out of that :-) )

[Pavlov]

ah ok - i didnt get it.
so it's not a flat plane with a Y texture, but more planes facing camera with a front-grass sample on each of them... right ?

Paolo

[roger1972]

ah ok - i didnt get it.
so it's not a flat plane with a Y texture, but more planes facing camera with a front-grass sample on each of them... right ?

Paolo
its a lot of planes with a grasstexture and a clipmap/trans.map.. I dont know how many but maybe 30.000 planes/polys with textures making the grass...

I could show you a snapshot of it but I have no material here at home...

[roger1972]

ah ok - i didnt get it.
so it's not a flat plane with a Y texture, but more planes facing camera with a front-grass sample on each of them... right ?

Paolo

thats right.. but its a chaotic order of facing, so it could be used in animations...

[Pavlov]

yes, i saw this technique used in Fry forum... i'n not sure how it looks in anim but it's interesting.
If i get it right, you pasted grass photo in the pic because it didnt look good because of that mapping thing... i wonder if you have a test done that way, anyway.. just curious to see how it looks.
Paolo

[roger1972]

yes, i saw this technique used in Fry forum... i'n not sure how it looks in anim but it's interesting.
If i get it right, you pasted grass photo in the pic because it didnt look good because of that mapping thing... i wonder if you have a test done that way, anyway.. just curious to see how it looks.
Paolo

I could post something next week when I'm back at my offices. LW + logmein is a really bad solution :-D
but it works really nice if you dont have to animate the grass like wind or something... just go into the garden with a white board of somethig and photo a lot of grass, make a good alpha and texture your polys with that...

[roger1972]

yes, i saw this technique used in Fry forum... i'n not sure how it looks in anim but it's interesting.
If i get it right, you pasted grass photo in the pic because it didnt look good because of that mapping thing... i wonder if you have a test done that way, anyway.. just curious to see how it looks.
Paolo

or you could take a look at the fry-forum and look at the technique in the fry-forum, It's the same technique but he got it right... :-)

[ingo]

..or look at the original tutorial here -> http://www.maxwellrender.com/tutorials/grass_tutorial.pdf

cheers

[roger1972]

tnx... maybe my method should be sharpened a bit.. :-) that realistic-design guy is a very clever man...

[ingo]

Its pretty easy to make, it just depends on how many of these gras-polygones you use. I use Pawel Olas's Random Cloner for that task, works pretty well.

[roger1972]

Its pretty easy to make, it just depends on how many of these gras-polygones you use. I use Pawel Olas's Random Cloner for that task, works pretty well.

better check that random cloner thing, and I have to redesign my grass too...
I tried making a grass patch with stravs wit pointclone in modeller and instance it over the whole scene but the rendertime was too high...

[Pavlov]

it looks like, somehow, grass is still one of the most complex thing to solve in exteriors.

Paolo

[ingo]

I don't think so, i have more problems with things like pebbles. The last project had some long bamboo hedges that are placed on whitegrey pebbles. luckily they changed the view so we don't look directly on them.

But here is some grass made with a 60 x 15 cm grass-polygon, the upper picture contains 30000 polys, the lower picture 20000 polys.

[ingo]

Ok, here its in a higher resolution :

[Pavlov]

Ingo, nice but random tiling looks quite CG, imho... maybe using 3-4 different patches can solve it.
A problem with this tech can be non planar terrains... landing grass can be tricky, but with some weighting-work and Pointfit it's doable.
I'd be curious to see results in animation.. gonna try myself.

Paolo

[roger1972]

Ok, here its in a higher resolution :

I think your grass looks quite good, maybe som texture overlying to get some different shades of color in the grass would look good?

[wavk]

any nice updates roger?

mlon

[Vujaka]

Kray supports instancing no?

[-EsHrA-]

vujaka - yes.


mlon